Ducati getting cold feet regarding producing an electric motorcycle - BMW S1000RR Riders Forum & Registry



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  1. #1
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    Ducati is backing away from electric motorcycles for now and is going to give alternate fuels a try to power their motorcycle engines, according to this short article.
    https://www.engadget.com/ducati-back...104508272.html
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    When you have an internal combustion engine, you can design it to produce a flavor unique to your brand. The Yamaha Tracer GT is like that. Three cylinders and lots of hp. The engine is one of the big reasons why you buy one of those.

    But with an electric motor? You have a motor, and a battery. It makes the motorcycle a generic commodity item, and trying to justify the high price of a Ducati would be difficult.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard230 View Post
    Ducati is backing away from electric motorcycles for now and is going to give alternate fuels a try to power their motorcycle engines, according to this short article.
    https://www.engadget.com/ducati-back...104508272.html

    Alternate fuels will be the future for ICE. Batteries in a motorcycle (especially for ones aimed at Adventure, touring, fun etc) won't 'work' or offer the capability fuels can. I mean you can carry a jerry can (of various sizes) which will get you 10+ miles, and your MPG with ICE is pretty consistent. But you couldn't do the same with a battery, unless you carried around a generator, spare battery, or they build charging stations quite literally in the middle of no where. The Lithium Ion batteries are currently affected too much by temperature (within the battery, and also the external environment) which vastly affects their performance and range.
    This will be a different question with better battery tech and better charging networks.
    BMW F800ST, 2010, Black, Fuzeblock, Sat Nav, BMW Tank Bag, Givi Touring Screen, Denali Spotlights, Denali CANSmart, Wunderlich Crash Bars, 55K Miles & counting 

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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ123 View Post
    Alternate fuels will be the future for ICE. Batteries in a motorcycle (especially for ones aimed at Adventure, touring, fun etc) won't 'work' or offer the capability fuels can. I mean you can carry a jerry can (of various sizes) which will get you 10+ miles, and your MPG with ICE is pretty consistent. But you couldn't do the same with a battery, unless you carried around a generator, spare battery, or they build charging stations quite literally in the middle of no where. The Lithium Ion batteries are currently affected too much by temperature (within the battery, and also the external environment) which vastly affects their performance and range.
    This will be a different question with better battery tech and better charging networks.
    But what sort of alternate or "synthetic" fuels might be as widely available as gasoline - and electricity, for that matter?
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard230 View Post
    But what sort of alternate or "synthetic" fuels might be as widely available as gasoline - and electricity, for that matter?
    Which circles back to what I have been saying for a long time. Hydrogen, ethanol, biofuels, etc, get government blessing because they maintain the established government means of control and extortion for campaign contributions. Never mind they don’t solve real problems. They solve contrived problems and provide more opportunity for government expansion entrenching established players in government and industry.
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    Either alternative/synthetic fuels would be as widely available as the current range of combustable fuels. Once the fuels become mainstream the price will settle down, and the wide spread availability will be ok. Transporting lots of fuel to one place is going to be a lot easier (as we already do it) rather than plumbing in HV electrical lines to middle of nowhere Fuel stations.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ123 View Post
    Either alternative/synthetic fuels would be as widely available as the current range of combustable fuels. Once the fuels become mainstream the price will settle down, and the wide spread availability will be ok. Transporting lots of fuel to one place is going to be a lot easier (as we already do it) rather than plumbing in HV electrical lines to middle of nowhere Fuel stations.
    Meh. EVs do not require “gas stations” the way the willful ignorant pretend. Too easy to start every morning with a full tank. The only need is what Tesla is doing with Superchargers, every 100 miles or so on major routes. Cross country travel is the only need for charging away from home.

    8 bay Superchargers commonly get a 750 kVA substation. Not that difficult.

    Rural Electrification Act of 1936 made access to electricity ubiquitous in the USA.
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    I'm pretty sure - or is that purty shore - that the internal combustion engine was pooh poohed by the horse brigade over a hundred years ago. 'Ittle nevah work. Grass is everywhaare'. Hoot they was wrong. Unless you still want to ride a horse specifically. Go gallop ahead.

    My first cell phone had a 2 kilo (google it) battery. Lasted a good couple of hours so long as I didn't make a call.

    Electric bikes and cars will improve in range.

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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    Meh. EVs do not require “gas stations” the way the willful ignorant pretend. Too easy to start every morning with a full tank. The only need is what Tesla is doing with Superchargers, every 100 miles or so on major routes. Cross country travel is the only need for charging away from home.

    8 bay Superchargers commonly get a 750 kVA substation. Not that difficult.

    Rural Electrification Act of 1936 made access to electricity ubiquitous in the USA.
    Not sure about you but when i ride my bike it's out in the coutryside, where most places of civilisation are small villages. And very few have a petrol station. If no one thinks there was money in building one, why would they lay HV cables for multiple EV chargers.....

    It's easy to start with a full tank of battery juice if you are able to charge your vehicle at home or have access to chargers nearby. For those that don't it is an issue.

    EV's infrastructure needs to work on a Global level in various countries. The world is bigger than just the USA.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RidaMile View Post
    I'm pretty sure - or is that purty shore - that the internal combustion engine was pooh poohed by the horse brigade over a hundred years ago. 'Ittle nevah work. Grass is everywhaare'. Hoot they was wrong. Unless you still want to ride a horse specifically. Go gallop ahead.

    My first cell phone had a 2 kilo (google it) battery. Lasted a good couple of hours so long as I didn't make a call.

    Electric bikes and cars will improve in range.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  17. #11
    Richard230's Avatar
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    This is a very interesting video regarding recycling lithium batteries: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLr0GStrnwQ
    Richard - Current bikes: 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior. 

  18. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by N4HHE View Post
    ...Rural Electrification Act of 1936 made access to electricity ubiquitous in the USA.
    You have to be kidding.

    Yes, I can get from Seattle to Spokane ...but only on the most boring routes.

    So this has been in effect since 1936? It's only been 85 years and it hasn't happened yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daboo View Post
    You have to be kidding.

    Yes, I can get from Seattle to Spokane ...but only on the most boring routes.

    So this has been in effect since 1936? It's only been 85 years and it hasn't happened yet.

    Chris
    By golly you have convinced me! Government must spare no expense in installing 100kW+ EV charging stations at every intersection because EVs will be totally useless if I can not drive every road, any time!

    Or, perhaps the truth is the correct goal is just to be able to drive most places?

    Tesla is spending their own funds to build Superchargers and has already blanketed mist of the nation. Seattle-Spokane is easy. Many alternates available.
    Click image for larger version. 

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  21. #14
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    You proved my point, David. Thank you.

    When I did my SS1000, I took I-90. Why? Because it was efficient. High speeds. Straight roads. My fear was that I would fall asleep on it. When I drove from Seattle to Spokane for the drill weekends with the WA Air Nat'l Guard, I fought to stay awake. Mile after mile after mile...straight...with no real scenery. Absolutely boring.

    Now when I went to the Coeur d'Alene MOA Getaway, how did I go? Not I-90. I went north to the North Cascade Highway. Then stayed on Hwy 20 till I got to Kettle Falls and dropped down on Hwy 395 to Coeur d'Alene. And just because Tesla has their Superchargers...can I plug in a Nissan Leaf? And if so, is it the fast charge? Or a slower charge? This makes a difference, because the early Nissan Leaf had a range of about 72 miles. Great for a commute. Lousy for anything else.

    But the point isn't to debate the pros and cons of electric cars. My wife has a Prius, which is half-way there. The point is that the gov't in Washington State can't take care of what it is supposed to take care of now. How will it do in adding all the infrastructure that is required to make this happen? They have proven they can paint the cross-walks rainbow colors to celebrate being queer. But they can't patch the roads the cross-walks are on. You can pass all the laws you want to do...but it requires the gov't to do something, and they have proven they can't.

    Forgive me for a little "bunny" trail, but when I read the paragraph above, my mind went to the freeway construction around our state capitol, Olympia. I may be mistaken, but it seems like it was going on for more than 20 years. It was a joke to anyone who didn't live there, and I suppose it was a nightmare to anyone who did live there.

    Chris
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  22. #15
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    From Ducati to political point scoring in one sermon!

    Here's what going on in the rest of the world Dabo:-

    https://www.ft.com/content/8e69d4da-...0-b5dc5c7ca40a

    Business see the opportunity of investing in charging infrastructure.

    Ride safely.

    Sent from my moto g(8) power lite using Tapatalk

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    My apologies. I had the thread on Washington State being the first to outlaw the sale of gas powered vehicles by 2030 on my mind and thought that was the subject.

    And now on to the Ducati news...

    Chris
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